Are Stars Fans Looking Ahead to the Draft Yet?
by Brad Gardner on Mar 24, 2010 12:30 PM CDT
in Dallas Stars Analysis
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PrintInvariably, there comes a time in each teams season when the fan base can either start looking forward to the playoffs (Detroit, this will soon be you) or shrug, sigh, get over it, and then wonder who will be available at the NHL Entry Draft. And when that time comes, many hockey patrons join a very small group of consumers who seemingly want LESS for their money because they feel that being in 15th place in the conference is more desirable than 9th.
With the Stars win last night they jumped from 13th to 10th in the standings, and consequently from 10th to 13th in draft order.
| Draft Order | Team | Points |
| 1 | Oilers | 55 |
| 2 | Bruins | 64 |
| 3 | Islanders | 68 |
| 4 | Hurricanes | 69 |
| 5 | Blue Jackets | 70 |
| 6 | Lightning | 70 |
| 7 | Panthers | 71 |
| 8 | Rangers | 71 |
| 9 | Thrashers | 75 |
| 10 | Wild | 76 |
| 11 | Ducks | 76 |
| 12 | Blues | 77 |
| 13 | Stars | 78 |
| 14 | Flames | 83 |
Repeating last years #8 position is looking unlikely with 9 games to play. Dallas needs only 5 points to tie last years' output, but the East really brought it's game this year, hogging all the top spots (apart from those magnificent Oilers). Ironically, there are teams like the Thrashers who are in better draft AND playoff position than the Stars. That's life in the West.
With 10% of the season yet to be played out, would fans really rather they lose?
Some say that once the writing is on the wall, the players slump their shoulders and apathy sets in. I disagree, but not entirely. It's natural for the compete level to come down a little bit, but once the puck drops and the in game battles commence, it's plain to see that they still want to win these games. You can't take the competitive nature out of professional athletes. Athletes don't care about draft position. The only way to tank in the NHL, or any sport for that matter, is to remove the players from the games themselves, and that's just not done in hockey.
In basketball you can shutdown an "ailing" superstar and essentially tank your season. You can trot a rookie QB in football and expect to continue losing. No one admits these things happen, but sometimes they do.
Besides, there are still story-lines to be played out. Can Kari Lehtonen continue to improve? Can Jamie Benn pass 20 goals in his rookie year? Can Mike Modano get back on the ice? Will Marty Turco be given a proper "goodbye home game"?
I'd like to see all of those things happen, and happen within the context of winning.
Still, picking 14th or 3rd, we have to educate ourselves as June and a reportedly deep draft approach.
Mike Heika says the Stars might want to turn their attentions toward collegiate players...
The Stars have signed a few collegiate free agents in the past, including Tyler Shelast out of Michigan Tech (still in the organization) and Hobey Baker winners Marty Sertich out of Colorado College and Junior Lessard out of Minnesota-Duluth. Sertich and Lessard speak to the success rate that Nieuwendyk is talking about, as both moved out of the Stars organization and stayed in the AHL. Lessard is now playing in Europe.
But the new GM insists that the team will be a part of aggressive scouting of any potential free agents.
``I think you definitely have to look everywhere you can for help,'' he said. ``They have done that in the past here, and we'll definitely keep it up.''
Here's a list of some undrafted college players.
Mark Stepneski has the updated chances of the Stars winning the draft lottery on this blog here.
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I just want to point out a random stat:
On a team chalk full of minuses, Mark Fistric stands at a gaudy +20. +20! Next best is Segal, with a +6, and he only has 11 games with us under his belt. Bet it would be worse with a whole season.
I think our D-pairs should be: Fistric-Fistric, Fistric-Fistric, andddddd Fistric-Fistric.
Robidas should be captain of this team, in my opinion. He’s such a warrior.
Here's to all us girls who love hockey...and the men who play it.
by Brad_Richards_Rocks on Mar 25, 2010 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
To stay optimistic
Detroit has had stretches of 3-7, and 3-11, the 3-11 one right before the break. Calgary has had stretches of 1-11, including a 9 game losing streak, as well as a few streaks of 1-4. These are the two biggest obstacles in front of Dallas, and it’s possible that these teams could do on similar downfalls to end the season. Dallas on the other hand, really hasn’t been that streaking (as we all know) and the best run I can find is a 5-2 run.
Detroit has 10 games left. If they go 3-7, they reach 91 pts. 3-4-3: 94 pts.
Calgary has 9 games left. If they go 3-7, they reach 89 pts, 3-4-3, 92 pts.
Dallas has 9 games left. If they go 4-2, and 2-1, for a total of 6-3, they reach 90 pts. 6-2-1, 91pts.
Basically, we need Detroit and Calgary to slip up, while going on a serious run. It’s possible. If other teams can do it, why can’t we? We’ve played and beaten the best teams in this league. It’s time to pack together, and make a move, and maybe, just maybe, we’ll get some help from the hockey Gods.
5
the number of spots we could jump if we went on a losing streak. drafting 7th would be tight as hell.
Why?
Who is the can’t miss prospect that you think the Stars could get with the 7th pick overall?
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by Art Middleton on Mar 24, 2010 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Its not cant miss
Brandon Gormley and cam fowler are two rock solid defensemen slated to in the 3-6 range, being seventh would make it easier to trade up to take one of them. and really since we’re out of the playoffs all winning does is….well you tell me. Im not wanting them to tank, I just want whats best for us next year:
A good Dman
Kari in net (we play awesome in front of him)
and I think we’ll just have to wait and see what happens.
Hell, no, we shouldn't think about how high we can go in the draft.
Since when is being drafted high a guarantee of anything? Just ask Kari Lehtonen, who went 2nd in his draft and is probably more familiar with doctors’ offices than the ice rink at the moment (fingers crossed that will change). In a thread some time back, I mentioned the 1994 draft class. In the first round (#20), Dallas chose Jason Botterill, who a total of 21 games with the Stars over two seasons in the late 1990s and spent the rest of the career bouncing between the AHL and NHL with Atlanta, Calgary and Buffalo. In the fifth round (#124), Dallas picked Marty Turco. Love him or hate him, you cannot deny what he has done for this franchise and the records that he holds.
There are still so many stories left to tell this season, as Brad pointed out. I’m pretty sure Jamie Benn will make 20 goals (he would have to go on a massive cold streak not to), but can he meet or beat James Neal’s Stars’ rookie record 24 goals? If this is Mike Modano’s last season, will we be able to see him one last time in a Stars’ uniform? How about Jere Lehtinen? If this is Marty Turco’s last season in a Stars’ uniform, will we get to give him a proper sendoff?
How many more games can the Stars win? I want to see the Stars finish their season with a little dignity, and for the players who will (or might) be playing the final games in a Stars’ uniform, give them the sendoff they deserve.
Yeah.
Dignity is a good work, me thinks.
by Brad Gardner on Mar 24, 2010 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Thank you.
I’m frustrated with the way this season has gone. We know these guys can do better. Why did shooters who averaged 30%-40% in shootouts suddenly tank to a measly 14.7%? Why are defensive players who have shown so much promise not living up to the potential they showed in previous seasons (yeah, we probably know the answer to this one)? Why has the goaltending fallen off from where it’s been in previous seasons (we probably know the answer to this one too)? I’m sure they are all frustrated, too. But I’m sure they’re not frustrated enough to lose for the rest of the season so the team can draft higher for a player who may or may not pan out. What did Matt Niskanen get for being drafted in the first round (#28)? Yeah, he’s in the NHL, but is he the superstar you would expect of someone drafted that high?
Heck, look at Jamie Benn. He was drafted 129th overall – even lower than Marty Turco had been taken in his draft. How many teams are trying to knock down Joe Nieuwendyk’s door trying to get Jamie for their teams? The draft can be a crap shoot. I don’t remember who said it, but someone made the point recently that Dallas has the habit of finding the diamonds in the rough in the later rounds in the draft. Jamie Benn would certainly fall into that category. So would Marty Turco. Loui Eriksson was taken in the 2nd round. James Neal was a 2nd rounder, too. We also have some other teams’ diamonds in the rough. Stephane Robidas was taken in the 7th round by the Canadiens. Brad Richards was taken in the 3rd round by Tampa Bay.
Look at San Jose – I’d say they did pretty well with their 9th round (yes, 9th round) draft pick in 1994. With the 219th pick, they took some guy out of Russia with the name of Evgeni Nabokov. He’s not playing for the team that originally drafted him, but Tomas Vokoun (9th round 1994, #226) is doing pretty well for himself, too.
I have no desire to see the Stars waste the rest of the season just to catch a pick which may or may not pan out. That is not what they are playing the game for. High draft position is not necessarily a guarantee of success, nor is a low draft position a guarantee that a player is going to be a career AHLer.
AMEN!!!
Besides it does more good for a financially strapped organization to win games and put butts in the seats than it does to draft 3-4 places higher.
Additionally I will be the last to give up hope that we can’t pull off the 8th playoff seed this year.
“Never tell me the odds!” – Han Solo
It’s a hit or bust a lot, but it’s definetely something to look forward to. Just because we drafted busts before, doesn’t mean we are going to hit another one. I think we should totally be thinking about our draft pick.
The only legit point you make is giving the Stars that’ll be playing their final games a proper sendoff. I would hate for Modano to retire not only not making the playoffs, but on a losing streak. Although the losing streak would be better for the future. Oh and Leht probably won’t be coming back after all the injuries he’s suffered. At least Turco will find employment somewhere else.
The season’s lost besides for sentimental reasons of seeing Modano and Leht play their last games after such magnificient careers in Stars uniforms.
I'll be truthful
I voted for the second and still hope they tank a bit. Sure it may make me less of the fan, winning is winning right? But I want to see this team win the Cup. I want to see this team become elite again. In 5 years, the pride of this group who’s let us down all year will not matter. Potentially having a star player will.
I live in Florida. I’m surrounded by teams that every year make a push to the playoffs then fall right outside the bubble. They’re rewarded with a mid round pick and next year do it all over again. I don’t want to see the stars mired in mediocrity every year for the next decade. You have to lose to rebuild. Following the model of Pittsburg, Chicago, Washington, etc is the way to go. Not “fight for pride” and finish 9th every year, ala the Panthers.
It may suck now, but now is the best time in our franchise history to rebuild. We’re on a self-imposed budget, meaning we already are at a disadvantage. We have 2-3 veterans about to retire. We’re in a position for two years of top 10 draft picks. There’s no better time to take advantage of rebuilding than now. If we wait an in 2-3 years we have that extra $10 million dollars on our payroll, but our prospects are weak, and we’re mired in medicrocity again, we’re going to be right back to the same place. Except we wasted a lot of years and a prime opportunity. The time has never been more right, and I’d rather us see us do it and be contenders for the next decade then try every year to just make the bubble.
by Unholy_Prince on Mar 24, 2010 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions
To me putting any notion in a players mind
that less than full effort is OK is just programing them to fail in the future. When the going gets tough in a playoff series it just makes it easier to give in. In the 3rd overtime of a cup finals you don’t want them thinking “We don’t really need this game, we have game 7 back at home”
Besides there are a fair number of these guys playing for their lives. You don’t think it would be important for Daley or even Nisky to end the season on a big point or goal streak? You don’t think former Conn Smyth winner Niewy isn’t watching how these guys compete when things look darkest?
Maybe you put some guys in situations that ask more of them and actually ask them to do more than you would normally. But you always want a full effort.
I hate watching the Stars lose, no matter the draft pick. Besides, you just never know with these high draft picks. Remember Richard Jackman? I think this year’s pool is deep, so we should get a pretty good player (hopefully a defeseman).
Here's to all us girls who love hockey...and the men who play it.
by Brad_Richards_Rocks on Mar 25, 2010 11:09 AM CDT reply actions
There's nothing worse
Than watching a team that doesn’t want to be out there. I’d much rather watch them play with intensity and dignity than tank and piss off the fans and players alike.
“Maybe you put some guys in situations that ask more of them and actually ask them to do more than you would normally. But you always want a full effort.”
Exactly. It’s experimentation time. Think you’ll have to trade Ribeiro? Sit him and give someone else a shot. Let Niskanen prove once and for all that he is either in or out. Although I think that point has been made long ago.
Put a team out there that ENJOYS playing for their jobs. No one wants to lose but I’d rather see them lose with grace than tank on purpose.
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